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I believe I understand and can relate to your concern. I was quick to point out when personal agenda's were brought up at Tuesday's post-GA informal discussion that I do participate with an agenda in mind. Perhaps now is as good a time as any to share that one of my guiding principles as a human being is "Do no harm." It's challenging to participate with those who're constantly on the lookout for monsters.

"Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you."
Friedrich Nietzsche
German philosopher (1844 - 1900)

Ronna, that's kind of the point of the Nietzsche quote. by way of showing them the door, you're recognizing the monstrosity of their character (see: behavior) and in a sense diverting your path from that of the "bear", as it were. The method I was suggesting is that in order to disengage "bad behavior" we must learn not to engage it. I've done so purely as a means of protecting my own sanity from certain individuals. The American Psychological Association defines mental illness as "A condition of behavior, which creates dysfunction". Let's just acknowledge when something is dysfunctional, then deal with it like adults.

It's a metaphor, Ronna. People can be just as monstrous as any bogey man.

Hi Terry!
I am writing this after our last GA on June 29. It is good to have a core group of caring committed people showing up who have the good of the group, the collective in mind! And to be educating ourselves about issues and group processes and movement/OWS philosophies and actions feels like OB is deepening and in a new state of becoming. It's a meeting I look forward to and want to go to and feel good enough about to invite new people to come. The way we open our GA's by checking in with each other and really sharing ourselves and what we have been learning during the week, what our concerns are and any actions we have been a part of, reports from working group(s), etc.

I like what Otter said about how important it is for Occupy for us to really know each other, to know about each other without any subterfuge, sharing ourselves with each other fully. That is the way to deepen relationships which is so necessary for a movement to be successful. As Mark and I were talking today, having good relationships with each other creates trust and this trust allows us to be honest with each other without getting our feelings hurt and or our egos crushed. This is so necessary for a movement to be powerful and be able to go out into the world to do good work that has good results. There has to be enough safety and trust for us to be honest with each other and redirect each other, etc.

I will only post this once to show solidarity with you, Terry. And I do it with trepidation remembering last winter when a situation along these same lines occurred and I must have been terribly misunderstood because of the vitriol and hatred directed at me in the forum. It does seem like you have not been fully supported in your post. The important part, I think, is to stop 'pussy footing around'. Behavior that keeps OB from being able to work on and take action on the issues because we are always dealing with this negative behavior/situation, is a violation and needs to be stopped. The question always needs to be "what is good for the group, the collective?" To have a group of people sabotaging this, who seem to hate OB and its members and to be out to destroy it, (as soon as the website was destroyed deliberately by David he should have been immediately dismissed), need to leave OB and find another more suitable group. This has nothing to do with a denigration of them, but everything to do with the choices they are making in disrupting and destroying group cohesiveness and integrity. In effect, they are choosing to be exited from the group by their own actions.

Many highly regarded groups including Occupy are grappling with this issue of 'difficult people'. There is a lot of research being published on this topic. The article that has been circulating "Dealing With Difficult People" as well as information for trainers in the 99% Spring Training of which Occupy was a co-sponsor all talk about the need and justification for disruptive people to not be tolerated.Anyone whose aim is to destroy Occupy, whether consciously or not, is an agent provocateur, whether they are on the payroll of some agency or not. The damage they do includes not being able to get to the real issues, cause the loss of valued members and prevents new ones from even joining and growing the movement.

In the 99% Spring Training, trainers were advised to deal with disruptive people immediately, to remind the disruptors of the particular group's goals/ expectations and to find out if they could meet them and if not, to let them know that 'this may not be the group for you' and "invite" them to leave. In our situation here at OB, if they do not exit then, we could do an intervention that would escort them out. If these procedures are not working well, the group could just relocate leaving the disruptor(s) behind, so to speak. We can go into more detail in a working group, do some role plays, contract Diane &/or Ellen Murphy to train us in intervention technique.

To draw these lines is not an easy task but for the good of the group and for OB, they are long past overdue. We can continue to work on the details but to give more time and energy to this issue is keeping us from the real issues like money out of politics, move to amend, and the casino economy/shadow government as revealed by Matt Taibbi.

I am prepared Terry to support you all the way because in supporting you on this, I am supporting myself and the group, OB, that I have an investment in to serve and protect. Several of us or all of us get some training in direct, nonviolent intervention technique. I will tell the person(s) banned from OB that they cannot stay, they cannot be an observer (this is not a spectator activity) they are invited to find another group. If they don't leave I will invite the other OB'ers to leave so we can meet somewhere else.

Thank you Terry for standing up and speaking your truth that is also my truth and I believe is the truth for the health and healing of groups that are truly alive, robust and striving to grow creative individuality vs needy individualism.

I do not intend to post further on this topic and only hope that I have offered you, Terry, the best support I can to add to your sense of well being in OB and to all our wellbeing. If people disruptive and destructive to OB are asked to leave, it may be their greatest opportunity to truly find a group that meets their needs better than OB.
Marcia Leister

Otter, what beautiful writing! I said I wasn't going to post beyond the one lengthy one above but am inspired by both of your posts.
After talking to Terry and realizing my own tendency as a teacher to take charge, I need to be reminded and redirected by people I trust who as of now, are the people who are coming to the Friday GA's and the Education working group. I give total permission to the people I am working with to correct me and keep me moving in the right direction. That is what a healthy group can do without folks getting their feelings hurt and all the behaviors that follow from that.
Terry had a good idea for us to take turns facilitating so no one of us falls back into the system we are trying to change and become the dominant controller, like it seems I could fall back into that myself. I call on my fellow occupiers who I have been working with over the past several months to guide me and help me to be the best I can for this movement.
With the Friday GA's being small, it is a safe place for everyone of us to practice facilitation and picking a support team to help facilitate.
Thanks group for giving me hope and solidarity with this movement!
with love, marcia